Color laser printer for decals? Opinions.

[P2K]

Now that waterslide decals are being used more often for pinball
graphic repair of playfields, backglasses, plastics and other items I
am looking for some actual experiences with using color laser printers
vs. inkjet printers for waterslide decals.

1) Up to now I have been using a run of the mill Epson color inkjet
printer that yields good looking results. My concern is ink fading
over time. I have heard that color laser toner is pigmented and ink
jet inks are dye based colors. Most people say pigmented colors will
last longer. Facts or opinions? Will color laser toner images outlast
inkjet images under equal conditions?

2) Do any of you actually use a color laser for waterslide decals?
What brand/model and paper brand works well for you and what doesn't?
I have tried a HP 2600 color laser with Papilio laser decal paper with
very bad results. Problems with both color banding on the printer and
badly distorted and jammed paper travel. Even though Papilio says
this printer should work I never had any luck regardless of heat
setting. The HP 2600 is not a very good printer anyway in my opinion
after using it for a while.

3) Color laser printers aren't supposed to be as good as inkjets for
the best photo quality printouts but most pinball graphics are not
going to the photo quality images, rather primary color graphics that
should suit color lasers fine. I would think that a color laser
printer could imitate the single color tones of the original
silkscreening image quite well. Experiences from anyone?

If you could post actual experiences with color laser printers using
waterslide decals, both good and bad, it would be very helpful for
advancing this decal repair technique.

Thanks in advance.
Alan

[seymour-shabow]

Post by P2K
3) Color laser printers aren't supposed to be as good as inkjets for
the best photo quality printouts but most pinball graphics are not
going to the photo quality images, rather primary color graphics that
should suit color lasers fine. I would think that a color laser
printer could imitate the single color tones of the original
silkscreening image quite well. Experiences from anyone?

Color lasers print with CMYK technology - silkscreened images CAN use
CMYK (meaning all the colors are created with just 4 screens, and just 4
silkscreened colors, like bally backglasses starting in the 70s (Lost
World I think was the 1st one))

However, 'spot color' is what silkscreening uses, meaning that the color
is custom mixed, which a color laser (or really, any other type of
printer that has multiple color cartridges) can only approximate by
mixing the 4 colors (or 6 in some cases) together.

Spot color is much more vivid since it's a homogeneous color being
screened onto the PF.

If you're printing insert decals though, what you want in a printer is
good density of print - inkjet decals I've made to test look fine until
there's a light underneath them, then they look like crap.

-scott CARGPB#29

[CornCob]

Post by seymour-shabow

Post by P2K
3) Color laser printers aren't supposed to be as good as inkjets for
the best photo quality printouts but most pinball graphics are not
going to the photo quality images, rather primary color graphics that
should suit color lasers fine.  I would think that a color laser
printer could imitate the single color tones of the original
silkscreening image quite well.  Experiences from anyone?

Color lasers print with CMYK technology - silkscreened images CAN use
CMYK (meaning all the colors are created with just 4 screens, and just 4
silkscreened colors, like bally backglasses starting in the 70s (Lost
World I think was the 1st one))
However, 'spot color' is what silkscreening uses, meaning that the color
is custom mixed, which a color laser (or really, any other type of
printer that has multiple color cartridges) can only approximate by
mixing the 4 colors (or 6 in some cases) together.
Spot color is much more vivid since it's a homogeneous color being
screened onto the PF.
If you're printing insert decals though, what you want in a printer is
good density of print - inkjet decals I've made to test look fine until
there's a light underneath them, then they look like crap.
-scott CARGPB#29

Modern Stern's, Sega from Apollo13 and Pin2k all used screen printed
process colour Cyan, Magenta, Yellow and Black (CMYK). Costs are
controlled because only 5 screens are required, thats right one for
base white ;)

You might be able to use a laser for titles from these manufacturers -
trial and error. My other half has a Dell 1320c and while process
colour, its limited to about 4K shades, not much in comparison to
modern inkjets.

For best results try and obtain the IIC profile for your printer's
ink. Some packages allow import and it'll save you time trying to
match your scan colours which are likely to be RGB.

Even spot colours can be duplicated to some degree in the process
colour model, with high enough DPI prints you shouldn't notice them
that much, however some are way out of most printer's gamut like those
neons on CV and the metallic's on back glasses for example.

Don't forget to post your results.

Ping
(thats right it's "colour" not "color")

[beaver]

My use of waterslide and laser has been limited to the insert text on
my F-14 restoration. It came out extremely well. I made sure I made
the toner level was heavy.
http://www.edcheung.com/album/album09/pinball/f14.htm

I have not used color laser and waterslide decals. Howver, I have
used color lasers quite frequently to print playfield and cab
overlays. Those have stood the test of time. Examples are my TOTAN
and MM restorations on my page.

Edward Cheung CARGPB26

Post by P2K
Now that waterslide decals are being used more often for pinball
graphic repair of playfields, backglasses, plastics and other items I
am looking for some actual experiences with using color laser printers
vs. inkjet printers for waterslide decals.
1) Up to now I have been using a run of the mill Epson color inkjet
printer that yields good looking results.  My concern is ink fading
over time.  I have heard that color laser toner is pigmented and ink
jet inks are dye based colors.  Most people say pigmented colors will
last longer. Facts or opinions?  Will color laser toner images outlast
inkjet images under equal conditions?
2) Do any of you actually use a color laser for waterslide decals?
What brand/model and paper brand works well for you and what doesn't?
I have tried a HP 2600 color laser with Papilio laser decal paper with
very bad results.  Problems with both color banding on the printer and
badly distorted and jammed paper travel.  Even though Papilio says
this printer should work I never had any luck regardless of heat
setting.  The HP 2600 is not a very good printer anyway in my opinion
after using it for a while.
3) Color laser printers aren't supposed to be as good as inkjets for
the best photo quality printouts but most pinball graphics are not
going to the photo quality images, rather primary color graphics that
should suit color lasers fine.  I would think that a color laser
printer could imitate the single color tones of the original
silkscreening image quite well.  Experiences from anyone?
If you could post actual experiences with color laser printers using
waterslide decals, both good and bad, it would be very helpful for
advancing this decal repair technique.
Thanks in advance.
Alan

[machine.slave]

Generally with any black that you want to be opaque, you'll need to
throw a mixture of the other 3 colours in there for support.
Generally C-60%, M-40%, Y-40% and K-100% is a good mix. You don't
want to use the full 400% ink or you'll over-saturate it, giving you
streaks and bleeding.

[Printer Deets]

Post by machine.slave
Generally with any black that you want to be opaque, you'll need to
throw a mixture of the other 3 colours in there for support.
Generally C-60%, M-40%, Y-40% and K-100% is a good mix. You don't
want to use the full 400% ink or you'll over-saturate it, giving you
streaks and bleeding.

I am currently using Epson EcoTank Color Printer for waterslide decals and completely satisfied with the printing quality. I hope you will find this guide very helpful about the best printer for waterslide decals: https://printerdeets.com/best-printer-for-waterslide-decals/

Do let me know if I can help you in something else.
Thanks

[John Robertson]

Post by Printer Deets

Post by machine.slave
Generally with any black that you want to be opaque, you'll need to
throw a mixture of the other 3 colours in there for support.
Generally C-60%, M-40%, Y-40% and K-100% is a good mix. You don't
want to use the full 400% ink or you'll over-saturate it, giving you
streaks and bleeding.

I am currently using Epson EcoTank Color Printer for waterslide decals and completely satisfied with the printing quality. I hope you will find this guide very helpful about the best printer for waterslide decals: https://printerdeets.com/best-printer-for-waterslide-decals/
Do let me know if I can help you in something else.
Thanks

This is interesting and a pinball relevant commercial for Epson. I've
played with waterslides but have not been thrilled with the results on
my office printers - Canon and Toshiba. I will test my home printer that
happens to be an Epson ET-2760...

Thanks,

John :-#)#

[diana anderson]

Post by Printer Deets

Post by machine.slave
Generally with any black that you want to be opaque, you'll need to
throw a mixture of the other 3 colours in there for support.
Generally C-60%, M-40%, Y-40% and K-100% is a good mix. You don't
want to use the full 400% ink or you'll over-saturate it, giving you
streaks and bleeding.

I am currently using Epson EcoTank Color Printer for waterslide decals and completely satisfied with the printing quality. I hope you will find this guide very helpful about the best printer for waterslide decals: https://printerdeets.com/best-printer-for-waterslide-decals/
Do let me know if I can help you in something else.
Thanks

What would you charge for a set as i don't have that kind of ink or paper or printer to make them so id buy ready to apply this is for a WW correct?

[PV]

Post by P2K
Now that waterslide decals are being used more often for pinball
graphic repair of playfields, backglasses, plastics and other items I
am looking for some actual experiences with using color laser printers
vs. inkjet printers for waterslide decals.
1) Up to now I have been using a run of the mill Epson color inkjet
printer that yields good looking results. My concern is ink fading
over time. I have heard that color laser toner is pigmented and ink
jet inks are dye based colors. Most people say pigmented colors will
last longer. Facts or opinions? Will color laser toner images outlast
inkjet images under equal conditions?
2) Do any of you actually use a color laser for waterslide decals?
What brand/model and paper brand works well for you and what doesn't?
I have tried a HP 2600 color laser with Papilio laser decal paper with
very bad results. Problems with both color banding on the printer and
badly distorted and jammed paper travel. Even though Papilio says
this printer should work I never had any luck regardless of heat
setting. The HP 2600 is not a very good printer anyway in my opinion
after using it for a while.
3) Color laser printers aren't supposed to be as good as inkjets for
the best photo quality printouts but most pinball graphics are not
going to the photo quality images, rather primary color graphics that
should suit color lasers fine. I would think that a color laser
printer could imitate the single color tones of the original
silkscreening image quite well. Experiences from anyone?
If you could post actual experiences with color laser printers using
waterslide decals, both good and bad, it would be very helpful for
advancing this decal repair technique.
Thanks in advance.
Alan

These folks deal in laser printer paper including waterslide decals. I have
had good success with their transfer paper. Have not tried the water slide
decals though.

http://www.jotopaper.com/index.htm